Normal Topic Protecting Another (Read 1815 times)
Majestic
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Protecting Another
May 14th, 2010 at 5:03pm
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F. Protecting Another
     One character may choose to protect another character by placing all (or part) of their body (if large enough) in between the attacker (or the attacker’s weapon) and the target.  This normally costs movement (the amount necessary to move to the location) and an action, and the protection lasts for the remainder of the turn, until the first action of the protecting character’s next turn (just like evasion), as long as both characters remain in those positions (with the protector between the attacker and the person they are protecting), as long as the original target does not move away.  If the protector is already very close to the defender (within 1”), then they may protect by spending 2 points of Power (as per changing facing).  Note that multiple attackers might still make it impossible for one person to protect another (unless backed into the corner of a room or a similar situation).  The attacker makes their attack normally.  A normal miss that would normally miss either target will miss both targets.  If the protector’s active defense would normally cause the attack to go through the protector’s body  (such as Non-Corporealness or Vibratory Powers), then the attack might carry through and hit the person behind the protector (the original target), provided the attacker is close enough for this to happen.  If the attack hits on a defense (like Adaptation or Willpower) of the protector that allows that character to shrug off the attack, resolve the attack as if it had been performed on the protector only.  A roll of a “1” will allow the attack to strike past the protector and hit the original target, and if the attack is a miss that goes wild, it will likely strike the original target as well.


It should be noted that I added the bit about doing the equivalent of a facing change (when the protector is close) based on comments here (like John's example).  That part of it has not been run by the rest of my group yet (though I expect they will be cool with it).
  
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Imaginos
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #1 - May 18th, 2010 at 4:20pm
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I would simplify it and say that a person may protect another by using their Evasion maneuver to apply to the other person (they are evading "into" the attack).  So the character evades, giving say a -6 to the person they are protecting.  If the attack hits within the -6 range, the protector gets hit instead of the protectee.
  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #2 - May 18th, 2010 at 4:45pm
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Imaginos wrote on May 18th, 2010 at 4:20pm:
I would simplify it and say that a person may protect another by using their Evasion maneuver to apply to the other person (they are evading "into" the attack).  So the character evades, giving say a -6 to the person they are protecting.  If the attack hits within the -6 range, the protector gets hit instead of the protectee.


This makes sense, but it does force the person to evade.  For us, often the bricks and big-strong types don't ever evade (there's no need for them to, as they often have Invulnerability, Armor, and such).

Also, I kind of like the new little bit that we just added in (the rest of my players like it as well) that we got from John and the people here on these forums (where the idea was suggested to jump in and take a hit if you're close to the target).
  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #3 - May 18th, 2010 at 5:07pm
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My thought is that the protector is taking their action to protect the other.  Of the top of my head, I don't remember if Evasion can be done out of sequence.  But the protector, even a brick or invulnerable guy, is still taking his action to protect the other.  THat's why I thought about evasion.  The guy who gets squirrely and can dodge the attacks should be able to get in there and protect someone using that same ability.
  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #4 - May 18th, 2010 at 5:24pm
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This has come up maybe once or twice in my gaming experience. When it has, we used this approach.

Trying to protect someone else requires one action and relavent movement on the part of the person doing the protecting.

An opponent requires a special attack to hit the blocked character (needing to successful hit roles in V&V terms).

If both of those roles miss, then no one is hit.

But if one of the roles hits and another one misses, then the blocker is the one who gets hit.

« Last Edit: May 18th, 2010 at 5:26pm by Mike »  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #5 - May 18th, 2010 at 6:36pm
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Imaginos wrote on May 18th, 2010 at 5:07pm:
My thought is that the protector is taking their action to protect the other.  Of the top of my head, I don't remember if Evasion can be done out of sequence.  But the protector, even a brick or invulnerable guy, is still taking his action to protect the other.  THat's why I thought about evasion.  The guy who gets squirrely and can dodge the attacks should be able to get in there and protect someone using that same ability.


In V&V Evasion isn't something that can be done out of sequence.  One has to use an action to do so.  So it makes it kind of tough to protect, if one has to have evaded already (how could they have known?); this limits the amount of people who could effectively protect, too.  In my thinking, it would be more of your Superman-tyoes (often a brick) who would step in and protect another.  With the way we do Evasion (so that it's done more by the high-Agility characters, rather than the bricks), using Evasion would mean that speedsters and agile types would be the ones doing the protecting, whereas I'd rather see it available to any hero who chooses to do so.
  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #6 - May 18th, 2010 at 6:37pm
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Mike wrote on May 18th, 2010 at 5:24pm:
This has come up maybe once or twice in my gaming experience. When it has, we used this approach.

Trying to protect someone else requires one action and relavent movement on the part of the person doing the protecting.

An opponent requires a special attack to hit the blocked character (needing to successful hit roles in V&V terms).

If both of those roles miss, then no one is hit.

But if one of the roles hits and another one misses, then the blocker is the one who gets hit.



This is a pretty effective way of doing it, and I like that it's simple and streamlined (not a bunch of rules), too.
  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #7 - May 19th, 2010 at 12:09am
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Majestic wrote on May 18th, 2010 at 6:36pm:
In V&V Evasion isn't something that can be done out of sequence.  One has to use an action to do so.  So it makes it kind of tough to protect, if one has to have evaded already (how could they have known?); this limits the amount of people who could effectively protect, too.  In my thinking, it would be more of your Superman-tyoes (often a brick) who would step in and protect another.  With the way we do Evasion (so that it's done more by the high-Agility characters, rather than the bricks), using Evasion would mean that speedsters and agile types would be the ones doing the protecting, whereas I'd rather see it available to any hero who chooses to do so.


This puts another idea in my mind.  Agile (or intelligent characters, IMO) should be able to use Evasion effectively.  How about letting resilient (END) or Strong (Str) characters resist?  Effectively, modify evasion so the fast or smart guys are doing what they do, but allowing the strong/tough guys to do what they do too.

So Evasion goes with Agil/Int, whichever is higher, and is a negative modifier to hit = stat/10.  Resistance goes with Str/End, whichever is higher, and is a similar negative modifier to hit = stat/10.  The idea being the character is able to shrug off the attack, just brush off the effects.  But he might get stung with one he cannot (which is why this is a negative modifier to hit instead of a subtraction to amount of damage).

Thoughts?
  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #8 - May 19th, 2010 at 9:35pm
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Imaginos wrote on May 19th, 2010 at 12:09am:
This puts another idea in my mind.  Agile (or intelligent characters, IMO) should be able to use Evasion effectively.  How about letting resilient (END) or Strong (Str) characters resist?  Effectively, modify evasion so the fast or smart guys are doing what they do, but allowing the strong/tough guys to do what they do too.

So Evasion goes with Agil/Int, whichever is higher, and is a negative modifier to hit = stat/10.  Resistance goes with Str/End, whichever is higher, and is a similar negative modifier to hit = stat/10.  The idea being the character is able to shrug off the attack, just brush off the effects.  But he might get stung with one he cannot (which is why this is a negative modifier to hit instead of a subtraction to amount of damage).

Thoughts?


Not a bad idea.  I'm assuming that to effectively evade/resist, it would still require the character to use an action (like Evasion normally does)?

I'd have to see it playtested to see if it was fair.  Strong types already often have powers and abilities that allow them to resist damage, so my concern would be that they might be able to get too much of a bonus (ignore too much damage).

Another concern would be how it is implemented.  If a strong character uses 'resist' to keep away damage, is that 1/10 Strength being used as a minus to be hit?  Or an additional number that they get to ignore (like Invulnerability)?  If it's a minus to be hit, then how does that really factor in game-wise? (normally a minus to be hit means a clean-miss, as one gets from Heightened Defense or Evasion).  This can factor into things like coincidental hits (when an attack goes wild because it just plain misses it's target).

So it might make sense for the S and E ones (resist) to basically give them an additional Invulnerability.  The question then becomes whether or not that is too much for a really strong character (that already has some Invulnerability).

In any event, since Initiative is based on Agility, the character with high Agility still has an advantage over all the others (if Evasion/Resistance costs an action).

« Last Edit: May 19th, 2010 at 9:38pm by Majestic »  
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Re: Protecting Another
Reply #9 - May 19th, 2010 at 10:22pm
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Good points.  I was thinking it would have to require an action, just so it doesn't get abused.
  
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