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Poll Question: How would you rate CRISIS AT CRUSADER CITADEL?



« Last Modified by: Guardian7 on: Oct 16th, 2009 at 1:26am »
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel? (Read 7073 times)
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How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Sep 8th, 2009 at 9:19pm
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When you played the first module of V&V's sizable listing of game supplements. What did you think. Explain your post if possible.

« Last Edit: Sep 9th, 2009 at 1:56am by Guardian7 »  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #1 - Sep 8th, 2009 at 9:24pm
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Crisis was the first V&V module I ever ran, so I made several mistakes, (had to keep referring to the rule book),  but I remember it fondly. While I liked the module, I like other books better.
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #2 - Sep 8th, 2009 at 9:58pm
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Where do I start?

This module had all the elements necessary (moreso than any of the others) to make a perfect Super Hero game.

It introduces you to a Reporter named Jessica Anderson, always a fun element to have in a game.

You have an opportunity to work with Detective Victor Broyko - an obviously experienced officer in dealing with super human criminals.

Your introduced to a high tech Company called Manning Enterprises (with Maps!) giving you a possible thumbs up to future associations (not including the enevitable run ins with J.B. Curtis head of Manning Enterprise operations).

There is a great selection of villains to start off with and most of them are the heroes of the adventure's enemies.

There is a superhero base (with Maps!) that is ready to be used with some great bits of info that make it fun for characters to explore (when not fighting).

Not only that but there is the Super computer TEACHER that they use and probably one of the Crusader's most valuable allies. There are Rockets, hovercars and Helicopters (ala-Fantastic Four) for the characters to use. Which is incredibly helpful for those that don't fly and have to get somewhere fast.

Last... but certainly not least. Is the incredible... amazing... wickedly cool heroes of the Module.

The Crusaders.

Blizzard, Evergreen, Enforcer, Dreamweaver, Laserfire and Manta Man.

These heroes have powers that range across the board. They come from all walks of life and vary in age.
They are mysterious, fun loving, serious, thoughtful, smart and heroic.

Now their worst foes have captured them and are up to something insideous... can you stop them before they succeed? Can you save the Crusaders before it is too late? Will Jessica ever get her story?

This is absolutely... the best module to me... without a doubt.

As Tina Turner would say; "...simply the Best!"

G7
« Last Edit: Sep 8th, 2009 at 10:02pm by Guardian7 »  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #3 - Sep 8th, 2009 at 10:11pm
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I loved Crisis. The villains are nicely developed, and the module gave a nice set up to the power levels of the world. Most characters have only 1-3 powers, and only Shrew and Bull have more than 20 hit points. The charactrs have nicely described backgrounds and battle tactics.

The main alts Ive made are to adjust the premise so that the heroes might be going to the Citadel to ask for the Crusaders help--or ask to assist--instead of wanting to join. Or, taking a tip from the comic, setting things up so the Crusaders had previously contacted new heroes and asked them to meet there all at once. The coincidental meeting is just too much of a silver age, has-been Marvel cliche.

The second alt is to have some, if not all, of the Crusaders permanently powerless as a result of the Crushers actions.

Finally, in the briefing with the police, I realized it would be good to also inform the heroes of other suspicious characters or at-large villains unconnected to the Crushers.

Overall, it's one of the strongest modules.
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #4 - Sep 8th, 2009 at 11:15pm
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A couple more notes about the characters:

The Crusaders
Everybody luv's Manta-Man
And laserfire
Evergreen grew on me (cuz of her relationship w/cuttie pie Shocker)

Not a big fan of Dreamwever or Enforcer
Hated Blizzard; he had the lamest backstory


The Crushers I love!
Marionette (who basically became leader)
Hornet
Vulture (although I wish he had a less Spider-foe name)
Shocker (although I wish he had a less Spider-foe name)
Mocker
Shrew

I'm so-so about Stormlorad, but he gets bonus points for a creative power combination.

I'm also on the fence about Temper, just cuz I like Marionette A LOT better, and two mind/emotional controllers in a team iz one too many.


Generic Crushers
FIST
Bull

Crushers who I dont like
Merc Mercenary
Mace

« Last Edit: Sep 8th, 2009 at 11:15pm by SuperFriend »  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #5 - Sep 10th, 2009 at 1:09am
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I've been reading a lot of posts on this site, and the Crusaders are one of the main things I keep seeing coming up again and again.  How many campaigns that module spawned?  I know it's been a basis for me, I've only been playing again a few months, but I go back to that module as a refrence, building relationships between characters, business associates... I just don't want to get away from it!  This module has obviously stood the test of time, and come out smelling like a rose!
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #6 - Sep 10th, 2009 at 4:48am
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I think it is partly my fault Hammer... I have been drowning these poor souls in Crusader stuff since I joined.

But they should be the highlight... they got the ball rolling... like em or could care less about them. They were the starting point for the mods and certainly the best mod in my opinion (even if some of the villains were a bit hard to stomach).

G7
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #7 - Oct 1st, 2009 at 3:54pm
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I realize this may not be exactly the place for it. But I have decided to place my own personal map of the Crusader Citadel here. With the same explainations of the place as was in my campaign.
I think it is a gorgeous map and it is completely specfic to the original Crusader's Citadel.

So... here it is again.

I didn't rewrite the areas and descriptions of the stuff that remained from the original C@CC... as I felt that for most of us was readily available from the module.

I am very proud of this and I think it shows my love of not only the Crusaders... but their Base (I also have an expanded Manning Enterprises somewhere, Bennent Software, Emerson Electronics and a host of many many others. I think it might be at my Ex-Roomies).

ANYHOW... here she is. My pride and joy
The revised...
CRUSADER CITADEL
LEVEL 1: This area remains pretty much the same. It is the location of…
1) The Citadel Main Computer center (TEACHER the sentient computer)
2) The Electronics/Cybernetics lab is under it and to the left (The old space shuttle housing is now the Citadel Independent Generator (They use no power but their own).
3) Right next to that is the Chemistry/Biology lab
North and across the hall is the Infirmary
4) Just under that is a storage unit (It is usually full of equipment necessary for the four other area of this level. It is left blank because of the amount of movement this storage sees, it is always at least half full for things of this level).
5) The southeast corner is the Citadel Elevator.
NOTE: the floor of this level is nearly half a story thick as a security precaution.

Crusader Citadel levels 1-2


LEVEL 2: This northern section is exactly the same as the original Citadel, with it‘s residence level, kitchen, pantry and four bedrooms. Beneath that it changes radically.
1) South-west of the original upper rooms are seven more bedrooms and a sitting area.
2) Just beneath that is the Weapons storage and ammunition room, this area has hyper security and will make the Citadel defenses go on full alert if entered improperly (including via non-corporealness and teleportation).
3) The lower southern section is the enlarged Trophy room.
4) Just above that is the standard work out room (no bricks please).
5) To the lower right and nearest the elevators is now the public meeting room (makes more sense for it to be on the residential level.

LEVEL 3: This level has radically changed. This level has a ceiling height of almost three stories.
1) The L pattern taking up the majority of this level is now the Combat Simulations room (CSR - Danger Room). North  and south-east of the CSR are the Combat array storage units (with additional unseen storage areas and processing machines located in the ceilings of the other rooms of this level), These are high speed loading devices that shift throughout the walls of the CSR.
2) The north most room is now the Crusader Meeting room with a TEACHER two way uplink screen, mini-tracking station, Security monitoring area and a Public announcement area with uplink to all the local news channels.
3) South of that is the  Emergency Monitoring  and Communications console. This vast computer scans for ongoing local or nearby crimes and emergencies nationwide, It also scans for major disasters worldwide, alerting the Crusaders. This is usually monitored exclusively by TEACHER. Though members can sit and scan for logs and immediate broadcasts for action (there is always something happening in large cities).

Crusader Citadel levels 3-4


LEVEL 4: Though the general layout has not changed. This is typically what the vast Hanger and repair area of the Citadel looks like when the Crusaders are IN residence. It takes up nearly an entire level of it’s own and there is always something to be done or work in progress here. There are three hanger entrances to the Citadel. Each entrance is considered a section of the hanger, though no walls now separate them into individual areas.
1) The Crusader “HUNTER JET” area. The largest hanger door is for this massive (60’) and incredibly fast aircraft.  Directly left of the Hunter is both its and the Hovercraft’s maintenance area. North of the Jet is the Hovercraft storage, diagnostic equipment and computer uplinks. Fuel storage is located in semi-oblong containers that are stored in super-alloy/heat resistant containers on either side of the hanger.
2) The amazing “Mark II Triumph”  Hovercrafts located throughout the hanger are able to move at speeds up to 300mph, there  are typically three located on the premises with one always in the ready position under it’s round launch bay door, just south west of the Hunter Jet. This is the most frequently used Crusader vehicle.
3) to the right of the Hunter Jet is the vaulted Crusader Jet Helicopter, this massive 40‘ long helicopter is possibly one of the most maneuverable machines in existence. It turbo jet engines can boost it to speeds of nearly a 1000mph. It is a flying infirmary as well and can be used to transport a multitude of accident victims.
To the right of it is a second backup Jet Helicopter and a maintenance area, Just north of this area are the various fork trucks and cranes to assist when the work gets heavy.
4) The Workshop is located right next to the Hovercraft launch bay. This is where the majority of fabricated material is made (if something cannot be ordered or it is a new development).
5) This room and the attached room are developmental power core generator centers for the massive electrical systems of the aircrafts. Though two of them use standard fuel to fly. They are being converted to a smaller power core similar to that which the Citadel uses to power itself.

LEVEL 5: The roof has also undergone some dramatic changes. The roof is totally smooth with only guardrails and the Dome breaking it’s surface. There are 5 hanger/sliding doors.
1) The upper left one is the stairwell extension, which slides open allow access via the stairwell.
2) Right of that is the Hunter Jet hanger door.
3) Right to that is the Jet Helicopter hanger door.
4) In the left bottom corner is the Hovercraft hanger door.
5) Far to the right is the rising elevator platform.
6) The only distinct feature is the massive clear Greenhouse Dome (Fern’s Eden) as the team calls it) on the roof. It is Evergreen’s semi private area, as She spends a considerable amount of time here in the sunlight or rain. There are water receptacles that catch falling rainwater and run it through a purification system for use of the entire Harmon Building in all capacities. Beneath the first level is a massive storage unit for capture water. The garden of the Greenhouse is stunning an vibrant with life. Birds do not frequent the Greenhouse even when it is open, because Evergreen keeps them away as she maintains the delicate balance of the unusual plants and trees within the Dome. This is the only place that does not have security weapons housed in it as Evergreen has hidden near sentient dangerous plants that defend the Dome for the Crusaders (Though they will not attack Crusader members).

Crusader Citadel level 5 - roof  / Citadel exterior - Hunter Jet illos


CRUSADER “HUNTER JET”: Designed by Telecomm (Cindy Green Agent of C.H.E.S.S. and Scientist for M.E.D.U.S.A.) of the Guard, she was kind enough to give them this  design of the BEE 3 (named after her husband and two children who were lost in a tragic accident - Ben, Erin and Eric). Which members of the U.S. Governmental team the Guard uses as well. Though a massively smaller version. Manning Enterprises and Bennet Software helped footed the bill, along with a sizable donation from Manta-Man via lost treasures he had garnered from under the ocean’s surface (primary source of revenue for the Crusaders).
Though the BEE3 was fast. Manta -Man (Carter Manning, owner of Manning Enterprises), Captain Cold (Aaron Bennet, Owner of Bennet Software) leader of the Justice Patrol and Pulsar (Bob Wagner - Owner of Wagner Aircraft) Co-leader of the Justice Patrol, tweaked the design and made it capable of moving at speeds of 2000mph, it is also longer than Telecomm‘s original design. As hers was 35 feet where as this aircraft measures a whopping 60 feet. It was renamed the Hunter by the Crusaders. Both the Crusaders and the Justice Patrol use the vehicle for long distance transport. The security measures of this aircraft make it virtually impossible to steal as the TEACHER (Crusader’s near sentient computer) uplink will automatically render the craft inert shutting down and disconnecting vital areas and components.
The interior of the BEE3 is located in the Devil’s Domain. Though I will hopefully be putting up the expanded interior design for the longer HUNTER JET.

Well. There it is. Hope you all like!
Would love to hear what you all think.

Cya
G7


  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #8 - Oct 1st, 2009 at 5:13pm
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I thought this might be useful for GMs of the Crisis at Crusader Citadel.

CRISIS AT THE CRUSADER CITADEL

TEACHER: Crusaders’ Citadel: Near Sentient computer of ultra advanced design

Jessica Anderson: Reporter WCTV Ch. 7

Newtronics: (U.S. Military contracts)

Bennet Software: A cutting edge software company that is ever pushing the limits of what computers and programs can do.

Detective Victor Broyko: Super-Criminal Task Force (Likely attachments to C.H.E.S.S.)

J.B. (Jonathon Burke) Curtis: Head of Manning Enterprises operations

Manning Enterprises: High Tech Company owned by Carter Manning (Manta Man)

CRUSHERS

F.I.S.T.: Frank Streeter. (Flying Infantry Shock Trooper): Design and Electronic components stolen by  Newtronics

Mercury Mercenary: Unknown

Temper: Thomas Perry. Unknown psychological study center

Vulture: Victor Truttle. former employee of Unknown ruthless science foundation

Bull: “Big Bill” Buckford

Shrew: Sheila Brewster. Former NAFBA (North American Female Boxing Association)

Mocker: Android Mark R. made by disgruntled research technicians from various corporations (Newtronics, Program Engineering, Manning Enterprises. Etc.).

Hornet: Henry Barnet. Small time hood modified by a manipulative Unknown organization.

Shocker: Johnny Shakura. Originally from Japan.

Mace: Theodore McIntyrre. Former inmate.

Stormlord: Stanislas Laird V. Son of Excalibur (British Hero).

Marionette: Marion Henderson.

Crusader Citadel: Harmon Building. Teacher, Crusader Hovercrafts and Jet-helicopters. Multiple high tech labs and residential area.

Dr. Ernest Patrovich: Inventor of TEACHER.

CRUSADERS: Well-known and very public with their Headquarters brandishing a huge C on all four sides of the uppermost Harmon Building.

Evergreen: Unknown. Mysterious Plant woman

Enforcer: Eric Forrest. Former secret agent, Dealings with “The Company” (Intercrime?) Former  body guard of...

Dr Randall Freidrich (Presumed deceased) developed the “Force Formula” worked for and was Killed by “The Company”

Dreamweaver: Donna Weston. Psychological student

Lynda Turner: Donna’s Best Friend. Psychological student

Manta-Man: Carter Manning. President Manning Enterprises and marine biologist. Widower, Leader of the Crusaders.

Miranda Manning (deceased wife of Carter - Artistic liberty taken for her name), Marine Biologist (Artistic liberty taken for her occupation).

Blizzard: Robert Ballard. Artist.

Laserfire: Larry Fredricks. High School student. Encountered a UFO (Unknown aliens).

G7
« Last Edit: Oct 1st, 2009 at 5:15pm by Guardian7 »  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #9 - Oct 1st, 2009 at 6:51pm
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SuperFriend wrote on Sep 8th, 2009 at 11:15pm:
Generic Crushers
FIST
Bull

Crushers who I dont like
Merc Mercenary
Mace



I guess tastes are just different, as you just named the coolest Crushers of them all, at least as far as I (and my original group of players) saw them.

F.I.S.T. ended up being one of the main nemesis of one of our original PCs (Pulsar), and each of these ended up playing a part in our current campaign!
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #10 - Oct 1st, 2009 at 6:55pm
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One interesting thing of note that happened in our campaign.  A long time ago (17-18 years ago?) my brother found a cool module for another game system (Champions? Supeworld?) that featured a villain group called the Zodiac.

They had really cool, full page, color artwork of each of the twelve members, and so he converted three of the Crushers over to this group.

So Bull became Taurus; Temper became another one (I don't remember which) , and Stormlord became Aquarius.  The amazing thing about the image in this adventure for Aquarius was that it looked exactly like Stormlord; the only exception was that the metal thingee over his eye (with a red eye) was on the wrong side.  He just rationalized that it was ornamental anyway (it's not like he was missing an eye), and so it didn't really matter and worked excellently for him!
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #11 - Oct 1st, 2009 at 7:05pm
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My favorites of the foes were:
Shrew
FIST
and Hornet (I liked Temper and Vulture as well).
Stormlord was important because of his attachment to my Exchalibur british hero. But he was snarky and whiney in my game.
Marionette was the most hated of them all... seems everyone hates a mind controller.
Mace had a great background and was a damn decent foe.
Shocker... I am not sure where to place him. I felt he was kinda forced onto the Evergreen situation... so I used it. Though he was eventually killed (By Merc Merc) when he reformed and started a relationship with Evergreen (Who in turn killed Merc... who I should say was trying to kill her as well).

I wasn't very fond of either Mercury Mercenary or Bull (as one was just out of hand evil with his weapons and superspeed combo and the other was a bonfide idiot).

The Crushers were hardly the highlight of that module for me. It was all about the Crusaders.

G7
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #12 - Oct 2nd, 2009 at 1:47pm
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You must have loved the Villains & Vigilantes comic, G7, being as how you love the Crusaders so much!

  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #13 - Oct 2nd, 2009 at 4:42pm
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No actually... I thought the comic was awful.
I was actually surprised that was Dee and Zircher's work... and Herman's writing was just as bad. Little wonder we only saw 4 issues.

Harsh I know... but I would rather be honest than to pat it up and make it sound incredible when I wouldn't advise anyone to buy it (dissapointingly so).

G7
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #14 - Oct 2nd, 2009 at 6:31pm
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Guardian7 wrote on Oct 2nd, 2009 at 4:42pm:
No actually... I thought the comic was awful.
I was actually surprised that was Dee and Zircher's work... and Herman's writing was just as bad. Little wonder we only saw 4 issues.

Harsh I know... but I would rather be honest than to pat it up and make it sound incredible when I wouldn't advise anyone to buy it (dissapointingly so).

G7


I thought the comic was great, but I did think the artwork could have been better.  I generally like most of Dee's stuff (and I love Zircher's work); for whatever reason one doesn't complement the other so much, and many of the figures ended up looking stiff and awkward.

I thought the story was decent (it actually reminded me alot of Crisis, as it was modeled so much after that module).

And I really liked the additional stuff in the back of the issues.
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #15 - Oct 3rd, 2009 at 12:21am
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Here's the various recaps I have done for Crisis:

First from the Sentinels comic:

#3 / Crisis at Crusader Citadel / Nightstalker joins group.  Thunderbolt made leader.  Team decimates Crushers and rescues the Crusaders.

Boy, I didn't waste much time with extra expository, did I?    Embarrassed  It's also interesting to me that for my old high school campaign we didn't start out with Crisis as the "introductory" adventure for the campaign.

I am pretty sure I've run this adventure at other times as well.


For Justice Force (though the group was called the Enforcers at this early stage), which started off our current ongoing campaign:

#1 – Crusher Crimewave – In Indianapolis, Indiana, a loose confederation of villains known as the Crushers ambushes and captures each of the Crusaders, their most hated enemies.  They imprison the heroes within their own headquarters, Crusader Citadel, and work to reprogram TEACHER, their near-sentient computer.  Calling themselves the Enforcers, the superheroes Tempest, Panther, Shroud, and Flaming Star are sent by C.H.E.S.S. to stop the criminals' unopposed assault upon the city.  After coordinating with Detective Victor Broyko and the police, they ambush the Crushers at a Manning Enterprises facility, ending their string of thefts of sophisticated computer parts.  F.I.S.T. and Mercury Mercenary escape, but Temper, Bull, and Vulture are apprehended.

#2 – Crisis at Crusader Citadel – Dr. Ernst Patrovich arrives and warns that the villains appear to be circumventing his creation, TEACHER.  The heroes invade Crusader Citadel downtown and trash the remaining Crushers.  Mace, Stormlord, Hornet, and Shocker are captured, and only Stormlord gets away.  The Enforcers rescue the incapacitated Crusaders: Manta-Man, Evergreen, Enforcer, Dreamweaver, Blizzard, and Laserfire.  Later, while the group establishes a headquarters in Miami, Florida, a mysterious figure oversees work elsewhere on an immense robot.
« Last Edit: Oct 3rd, 2009 at 12:22am by Majestic »  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #16 - Oct 4th, 2009 at 8:36am
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nice recaps.
But of course I am probably THEE biggest Crusader advocate in the world.

I wonder if the comic would have been better if Zircher had done the pencils and Dee had inked... It might have looked better. I looked VERY rushed and the figures were very stiff and awkward looking. Nothing like the flowing feel of Dee's V&V work (I would bet it had something to do with deadlines...)
Friend of mine did a Wonder Woman annual, A Comet/Impact issue and a Spider Woman backup story in the end of an Avengers West Coast annual. His work is gorgeous... I mean truely gorgeous. I have NEVER seen anyone draw hands like he does.
BUT...
His work on all of those was bordering on awful. I was stunned when I saw it... At first I blamed the inker... but I didn't see any of his very cool layout styles that I was accostumed to. When I asked him what happened... I think he was a bit embarassed... but he eventually confessed it was the deadline crunch (Which is why he always felt I missed my calling... because of the speed I can draw at - I did 42 pages in 24 hours once... including inking them, granted not strong inking. But I did it. He said I would be a shoe in for doing 22 pages, That I could take a little more time and slow down, doing fuller drawings. He said at that speed I could end up with two comics a month... But I never did it - boo hoo! LOL - frankly with the mental retards writing comics these days... I am glad I didn't do it).

BUT... if I had a chance to do a Crusaders Comic... I would so totally groove on it. I have seriously considered (toyed with) doing my version of Crisis at the Crusader Citadel.

Oh... and for the record... Herman/Dee introing those two butt ugly chara of Shatterman and possibly the lamest looking bird guy since Northwind of Infinity Inc was a total kick to the groin... I wish they had HAD time and allowed readers to send in three chara that would have helped them (The Crusaders). Sort of a contest thing (with all rights to the characters going to the Crusaders creative team - like the oddly fun Dial-H-4Hero in the Adventure comics - some of whom were rendered by Perez on the covers! SWEET!).

I fault the writing as not being at all strong for the comic. I think their color choices were pretty off with the chara and they should have rethought using those color patterns. THey just didn't stand out.

That's my opinion.

G7
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #17 - Oct 11th, 2009 at 12:52am
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Have to say I LOVE this mod but, if you put Death Duel and Island of Doc A together then that is IMO a far more epic scenario (for me and my group Doc A was the first real, and ongoing, mega-villain for a good long while - ala Doctor Doom or Magneto).

Still C@CC really reminds me now of the amazing Masters of Evil storyline from Avengers, with all of the inherent grudges and the taking over of the heroes' headquarters.  Not to mention the love story between Evergreen and Shocker (a BRILLIANT touch IMO).

For us it was the jumping on point for V&V (wanted to run Death Duel, given my love of Elementals, but when I read this mod I knew it was absolutely the best possible starting point and now I really wouldn't start with anything else - unless I came up with it myself).  It just has everything to sum up the game and really give the whole flavour of it to both new and experienced players.

The only modification I would make to it now is to have my characters discover some clue(s) that lead them to the Citadel, rather than have them apply for membership.  Not sure what they would be yet but it just makes a little more sense to me (even though I love the whole quirky SA coincidence stuff) and, more importantly, wouldn't seem contrived for my players.  It can also lead to the expectation on the players' part that, because they've saved the heroes, they're shoe-ins for membership.  Then when they don't get it the Crusaders can come off looking a bit sanctimonious and ungrateful.

But I gotta say that I love both the Crusaders and the Crushers as characters.  While I love the design of Manta-Man (but then again, who doesn't) I'd have to say that Dreamweaver was actually one of my favourite characters.  I also really liked Evergreen, but these days I think she just looks a little too much like Marge Simpson to be taken seriously.  Nevertheless she is a great character.

As for Crushers, I really liked F.I.S.T., Shocker and Marionette.  Temper had some strong points too.  But hands down my favourite was Mocker.  C'mon, he's a vainglorious android with a childish (read fart noises) sense of humour!  What's not to like?  I had a ball playing him.
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #18 - Oct 11th, 2009 at 1:02am
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Have to say I agree with G7 on the V&V comic.  For such an awesome mod it was a woefully inadequate comic.  It had all the set-up to be spectacular, with so much character drama in the module I just can't understand why that did not translate to the comic.  As G7 noted, there is a lot of weakness in the writing.

But then the art wasn't really anywhere near up to scratch either.  Beautifully put together character designs in the module are translated to horribly awful colour schemes in the comic.  And the art itself was so staid and lackluster I actually wondered if Dee had gotten himself a ghost drawer for it and then just stuck his name on it.  Really did not show the level of quality work both he and Zircher are capable of.

And while I like Shatterman and Condor as game characters (although Condor's costume needs a serious re-work) they were just awful as characters in the comic.

What was worthwhile for me, in the end, was the V&V game materials in the back.  I really like Manstar as a character, enjoyed the Shatterman and Condor outlines as well as the Shuttle, but hands down my favourite was Hauntress.  The way the Shrew died was just priceless, and I think the new character would be really fun to play (even though I never have).
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #19 - Oct 11th, 2009 at 1:05am
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Having just rambled on like a loon regarding the comic, I'm now wondering if anyone has ever used the game materials that came in the back?  As I'm now thinking of running a new campaign in which I want to feature the Crushers as some of the major bad guys, and would like to bring both Manstar and Hauntress into that, I'm wondering what people think about them and if they have encountered any problems with them in game play?
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #20 - Oct 11th, 2009 at 10:45am
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Paul Sunderland wrote on Oct 11th, 2009 at 12:52am:
Then when they don't get it the Crusaders can come off looking a bit sanctimonious and ungrateful.


Or worse, embarassed or weirdly threatened by the PCs success.

Agree with much of your review!
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #21 - Oct 11th, 2009 at 4:52pm
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Doctor Foom wrote on Oct 11th, 2009 at 10:45am:
Or worse, embarassed or weirdly threatened by the PCs success.


Yep, that too. Grin

Just doesn't seem to be worth the grief to me, and there are clearly other ways to get the characters there.
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #22 - Oct 12th, 2009 at 1:06am
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well I highly doubt the Crusaders would be so petty as to come off as sanctimonious, ungrateful, embarassed or weirdly threatened by the PCs... they got jumped. They got taken... others came in and helped them. I personally can't see any of them being any of those things (especially if you base their personalities on those shown in the comic - which is a great indicator).

G7
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #23 - Oct 12th, 2009 at 1:20am
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Guardian7 wrote on Oct 12th, 2009 at 1:06am:
well I highly doubt the Crusaders would be so petty as to come off as sanctimonious, ungrateful, embarassed or weirdly threatened by the PCs...

Exactly. There's no evidence in the module that they would have that approach at all. Manta-Man is clearly level-headed. Blizzard is decidedly heroic. And I don't think anything would phaze Enforcer. If you play the Crisis module and don't want the heroes to join the group, a good explanation might be that for security reasons the team needs to regroup and get their HQ back in order before even thinking about expanding membership. I could see them encouraging the new heroes to work on their own out of respect, not out of any standoffish or competitive reasons. The Crusaders didn't seem to be written that way at all. I really dig that module!!!
« Last Edit: Oct 12th, 2009 at 1:21am by SuperFriend »  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #24 - Oct 12th, 2009 at 3:11am
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The comment wasn't a reflection on the characters, as I've never played them to be sanctimonious etc.  But I've had players who saw them that way regardless, despite my best efforts, because they didn't get to join the Crusaders and play with all the neat toys.  Smiley

It was more a comment about player perception than the characters themselves.  I just think there might be better ways to get the players to the Citadel, without having petty players feeling jipped when they don't get to join.  I guess what I'm saying is that it has the potential to be a bit of a can of worms with some players.

And, having re-read the mod over lunch today, it's still the only thing I would even consider altering.  C@CC is hands down one of the BEST V&V (if not superhero rpg) modules ever written.  Guess I didn't make myself clear on that point.  Sorry.  Smiley
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #25 - Oct 13th, 2009 at 4:10pm
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One interesting change from the adventure to the comic was the change in color of Manta-Man's costume.  I ended up changing it in our campaign as well, as I really like the new one (even though yellow isn't the most practical color, despite heroes like Wolverine, Power Man, Iron Man, and Iron Fist wearing it).
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #26 - Oct 13th, 2009 at 4:32pm
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Not especially keen on the colour scheme for Manta-Man in the comic myself.  When I first saw him in the mod I had a concept of him as blue and grey and have never been able to get that scheme out of my head.  So you can imagine how jarring I thought he looked in the comic.

But then I thought Laserfire was blond too so...  Smiley
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #27 - Oct 14th, 2009 at 10:06pm
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First adventuer we ever played!
Fond memories cause my dad ran it for us and he has since passed ( about 3 years now)
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #28 - Dec 23rd, 2009 at 3:32pm
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This was a great module.

One of the  PCs with heightened senses spotted Stormlord on the Harmon Building roof right away, so we broke in and battled the Crushers immediately. We jumped straight to Part 2 instead of Part 1. All 12 of the villains were there.

To help us out, Shocker switched sides and helped us out.

We were badly outnumbered and beaten.  But it was so much fun.

The escaped Crushers later returned with some new members. They were great villains.
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #29 - Dec 27th, 2009 at 9:37pm
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We ran a group of four-color villain PCs for a while. Our first mission was to defeat the Crusaders, then take over the Citadel without anyone knowing. One of the PCs started wearing Manta-Man's uniform to pass as the hero. A few of us had similar enough powers to pass as other Crusaders in the right costume. Others simply pretended to be new heroes. We used the Citadel as a base for a while, went through a few more adventures from the villains' perspective, but were eventually captured. It was interesting doing the campaign from the other side of the looking glass.
« Last Edit: Dec 27th, 2009 at 9:38pm by Stacia »  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #30 - Dec 29th, 2009 at 2:55pm
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Stacia wrote on Dec 27th, 2009 at 9:37pm:
We ran a group of four-color villain PCs for a while. Our first mission was to defeat the Crusaders, then take over the Citadel without anyone knowing. One of the PCs started wearing Manta-Man's uniform to pass as the hero. A few of us had similar enough powers to pass as other Crusaders in the right costume. Others simply pretended to be new heroes. We used the Citadel as a base for a while, went through a few more adventures from the villains' perspective, but were eventually captured. It was interesting doing the campaign from the other side of the looking glass.


Sounds like a very cool (and fun) series of adventures!

Welcome to these boards, Stacia!
  
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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #31 - Dec 29th, 2009 at 3:11pm
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I must have missed this post.

Yes, Stacia
  That sounds fun.  What happened to the characters after that adventure?   Were you defeated?  Was it a one shot thing?

My old group would play villains every once in a while with the understanding that they would be spending a lot of time on the bench if their character's got caught.   So they had two or three bad guys to bring out when one of their villains was incarcerated.

  Then I made up a Punisher type to clear out the "extra" characters...
  

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Re: How would you rate Crisis at Crusader Citadel?
Reply #32 - Dec 29th, 2009 at 10:49pm
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John wrote on Dec 29th, 2009 at 3:11pm:
I must have missed this post.Yes, Stacia  That sounds fun.  What happened to the characters after that adventure?   Were you defeated?  Was it a one shot thing?My old group would play villains every once in a while with the understanding that they would be spending a lot of time on the bench if their character's got caught.   So they had two or three bad guys to bring out when one of their villains was incarcerated.  Then I made up a Punisher type to clear out the "extra" characters...


I was part of that play-a-villain campaign. The six of us defeated the Crusaders and kept them in the life tubes. My character wore Manta-Man's costume. Two other PCs posed as Dreamweaver and Blizzard. The other three PCs pretended to be new heroes. In a crunch we said Enforcer, Laserfire, and Evergreen were on a top secret mission.

We went through a couple of other modules, pretending to be heroes but filling the villains' objectives. Eventually we were caught by the Rookies and a number of other real heroes from the game. It was a huge battle, and it was fun going up against many of those heroes.

None of us players were big on playing evil characters, so getting caught in the end was a good thing. Being a villain was running its course.
  
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