I was surprised to see the part about "out of print".  Obviously the Apocalypse module hasn't been out of print.

And the "republishing" part sounds a bit premature.  FGU has already republished Death Duel as a PDF.

The new stuff sounds good though.  Hopefully MHG won't take 7.5 weeks to (finally) start putting out some new stuff.  A time frame like that just seems excessive.

Oct 9 to Nov 30 = 7.5 weeks

mw

@Allen- That's a thin argument (again) and doesn't do anything to refute the continuity of the trademark by FGU. Being that you don't have a juris and you're not interested in any of the countless reasonable points that have been demonstrated time and time and time again by so many, your news is more like the National Inquirer.

@Ranger - FGU doesn't dispute the IP rights in any of this mess- The fact that those IPs published under the trademark of the game and the game was/is published by FGU under a long standing contractual agreement (@Allen - See: Statute of Limitations) that is 32 years in the running is the core of the issue. Bill can make comics with his IP, he can take them to LL, but for V&V he needs to go through his contract obligation at FGU. Bill still has to abide by the same rules as Jeff and Jack, although I believe he has been snowed by Jeff.
Jeff has been the filter for communications to Jack and Bill for many years. A conversation with Scott would do Bill a ton of good, if nothing else to create good standing for himself and a clear point from which to proceed.
Ask Jack and Bill if they have talked to FGU lately or if they're getting all this second hand from Jeff.... I think you'd be surprised.

The argument as written on your forum proves nothing other than you and your wife (Talzhemir is Amanda Dee) are trying to convince everyone that you cashed your royalties checks for over thirty years by accident and are now jumping on the change of location and organization of business as FGU ceasing to exist.
How stupid do you think we all are, Jeff?

You're a Dee-droid whose 'burning sense of right and wrong' isn't interested in the facts and only interested in whatever toe-hold will help you sleep at night.
You are ignorant and highly misinformed...
KNOWING THE SCORE also constitutes that Jeff's track record showed his disagreement for a long time prior to his attempt to smash and grab the trademark... and cashing his checks all  this time and then trying to say "I didn't know" and "Now that I know, I disagree" is such an anorexic argument.

And Allen, I get my information first hand, not from forums.

whatever Jeff...
I'm not worried about anything.
We keep chugging along.
You don't play well with others.
You're still full of crap about the royalties checks... and you're purposeful ignorance of contract law is no excuse, especially in this industry. You have spent so many well documented years focusing on vitriolic bashings of Scott, FGU, and (gasp) V&V itself, trying to dismantle with your rhetoric, you just can't come to the legal table and plead ignorance now. That ship sailed a long time ago.
That's what makes FGU's case more than anything, and that is what YOU are worried about.

It's a shame too, Jeff, because I think you're great for the game in a lot of ways. But it's so important that a leader know how to sacrifice for a team and take a few lumps to keep trucking. But it's very evident by your all consuming need to 'own' that you just don't play well with  others for others' benefit, like the fans...
...like always...
...it's all about you Jeff.

That's a good question, don't you agree, AK? Why HASN'T Scott sued us, if he thinks we're in violation of some contract with him?

-Jeff Dee
Monkey House Games

Jeff Dee wrote on Nov 6^th, 2010 at 7:06pm:


We all know that both companies are still down as Trademark Applicants. Isn't that why the big shakedown went down at the yahoo forum?

C.L. wrote on Nov 7^th, 2010 at 10:53pm:


Actually, your question DOESN'T flow in two directions.

Jack and I do not accuse Scott Bizar DBA Fantasy Games Unlimited of breaking any contract. We had a contract with Fantasy Games Unlimited INCORPORATED, which ceased to exist in 1991. We have never had any contract with Scott Bizar DBA FGU.

AK, on the other hand, DOES accuse us of violating the contract we had with FGU Inc., claiming that it has somehow transferred to SB DBA FGU. It hasn't, but still, the specific question you asked is really for HIM to answer.

-Jeff Dee
Monkey House Games

Jeff Dee wrote on Nov 8^th, 2010 at 9:57am:


Fair enough. I'm glad to hear that FGU didn't break any contracts.

dsumner wrote on Nov 8^th, 2010 at 9:59am:


Just out of curiosity... what, in your mind, will have to happen in order for this to be 'over' in a way that 'everybody will abide with'?

A mutual agreement between MHG and Scott Bizar? There's no reason to think that's ever going to happen.

A trademark victory by MHG? That will be followed EITHER by a challenge from Scott (and around we'll go again), OR he'll go right on violating our trademark, and begging us to sue him - dragging this all out even longer.

A trademark victory by Scott Bizar? That will be followed by a challenge from MHG (I've explained why we think such an outcome would be appallingly unjust, above), and failing that, we will re-release the game under a new name. Because remember, the trademark and publishing rights are two completely separate questions.

No matter how you slice it, this dispute is going to go on for quite some time. This is why I've disobeyed the advice of our lawyer, and taken our case to YOU, the fans. YOU are the ones who will really decide when it's 'over'.

-Jeff Dee
Monkey House Games

C.L. wrote on Nov 8^th, 2010 at 10:57am:


Good for you. How is that a disagreement with my statement that "this dispute is going to go on for quite some time"? What are you asking me to give you a break ABOUT, exactly?

Quote:


Dude, my Aunt Edna could be an 'applicant' for the V&V trademark if she wanted to. At the moment, what matters isn't who has applied, it's who has the more justified claim.

Quote:


If you think V&V is already perfect, then you haven't been paying attention to any of its other fans. And if you think Jack and I haven't been working our asses off to deliver a high quality product, then you haven't been paying attention to MHG. V&V could certainly use some work, and the new "Revised Saving Throws and Task System" ( http://monkeyhousegames.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/Saves-Tasks.pdf ) shows the approach we intend to take in improving it.

-Jeff Dee
Monkey House Games

So which side is Captain America and which side is Iron Man?

Again  - whatever Jeff.
I will let the lawyers do their job. And they will.
How unfortunate that what your argument does is come down to splitting hairs about who you had an agreement with. For better or worse and to the detriment of the fans, we all know who you had an agreement with, and we know why you're doing this.
We have watched you for years bash and beat on everything for the exchange of venting your bitterness about your grievance.
You know who your agreements were with. The fact that just now you seek the loophole to be a welch, for a thing (that by demonstration) you have shown for all these years to love less than we do, shows me your true colors.
No ethics, no loyalty from you to anyone else.
You tried to snake into the forums after your declaration and get guys like me, who were given at least some opportunity from Scott to help 'your game', to switch 'sides'... what and become the bitter turncoat you are?
If I lose the opportunity, it won't be the last, and I'll go on playing, creating, running and even self-publishing for this game for no profit.
You're a master of parsing posts and arguing, exaggerating points with inappropriate adjectives, and making clear your entitlements...
By the way...

"No matter how you slice it, this dispute is going to go on for quite some time. This is why I've disobeyed the advice of our lawyer, and taken our case to YOU, the fans. YOU are the ones who will really decide when it's 'over'."

Stop putting this on the fans. Though I have been following a marvelous opportunity to contribute to this thing I love as best I can amidst any personal turmoil, at the end I'm still a fan. I haven't asked anyone here to shaft you for the sake of this dispute... it must kill you to see the success stories around you and then point a finger at Bizar. In my opinion, you're a miserable backstabbing ungrateful bitter piece of work (edit) Dee... and after abandoning your game for all those years (please Amanda, don't bother, there was indeed life before the internet and it wasn't smoke signals), you want to waltz in and cry like a baby about how Scott has stopped you from taking care of your game and let the internet forum crowd die hards take the place of the courts... don't worry you'll be sued soon enough.

My sincerest apologies to this forum and others as well. I'm a human being and maybe not a great one at that.

Great replies.

Now could someone scan in and post the actual contracts that apparently are in dispute? I'm aching to read the primary sources! That'd help me make an edu-ma-cated decision.

C.L. wrote on Nov 8^th, 2010 at 1:19pm:


CL, and I don't mean to sound like a dick, but those contracts aren't rally any of our business. They're private business documents, and unless you were party to them, why would you think that you would be allowed to read them? Now if any of the writers chooses to post a contract, that's up to them. But thinking that they'll just whip one out, scan, and post it because, someone who really has no say so what-so-ever asks, is in my opinion going a bit to far.

Sorry again CL.

This is a polite request for MHG, Jeff Dee and those that fanatically support his position to stop trying to derail/piss on conversations where FGU's creative people engage fans in constructive dialogue about the game and its future or development and also not to allow the fostering of defamatory speech in your forum. That's as close to a cease fire as you're going to get and you can expect reciprocal treatment.

Mr. Dee is unaware.
I want to refrain from further negative commentary.

C.L. wrote on Nov 8^th, 2010 at 7:03pm:


I'm not trying to block anything, and if I gave that impression, that wasn't my intent. I just think that 1) the contracts are none of our business, and 2) it really doesn't matter what any of us think about them, as we don't get a say-so on who "wins". Either way, if any of the parties involved want to post their contract, that's their decision.